Unpacked with Ron Harvey
People Always Matter. Join Ron as he unpacks leadership with his guests.
Unpacked with Ron Harvey
Forget Management 95: Why Command and Control Is Dead
Lior Arussy shares why leadership is no longer about being the invincible authority with all the answers, but about embracing vulnerability and taking action when you don't know what the right thing to do is. This fundamental shift transforms how we connect with teams, build trust, and foster genuine engagement.
• Vulnerability in leadership means strategically sharing stories that activate others to join your journey
• Employee engagement comes from understanding impact and having the tools/authority to get work done
• "Response-able" is giving people both the responsibility and the ability to respond
• Command and control leadership is dead – exceptional performance comes from personal choice
• Stories, not data, drive people to action and inspire meaningful change
• The "gratitude denial syndrome" robs leaders of insights about their superpowers
• Organizations must choose: are they processes operated by people or people using processes?
• Three key challenges: AI changing customer relationships, developing leaders in hybrid settings, and delivering "one and only" experiences
• Choose customers carefully – wrong customers consume resources needed for the right ones
Check out Lior's new book "Dare to Author" which helps leaders convert past experiences into future resilience and tools to face uncertainty.
Connect with Ron
Just Make A Difference: Leading Under Pressure by Ron Harvey
“If you don’t have something to measure your growth, you won’t be self-aware or intentional about your growth.”
Learn more about Global Core Strategies
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Disclaimer:
The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the speakers and guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of any organization or entity. The information provided in this podcast is intended for educational and informational purposes only and should not be considered as professional advice. Listeners should consult with their own professional advisors before implementing any suggestions or recommendations made in this podcast. The speakers and guests are not responsible for any actions taken by listeners based on the information presented in this podcast. The podcast is not intended to be a substitute for professional advice or services. The speakers and guests make no representations or warranties of any kind, express or implied, about the completeness, accuracy, reliability, suitability or availability with respect to the information, products, services, or related graphics contained in this ...
Welcome to Turning Point Leadership Podcast with your host, ron Harvey of Global Core Strategies and Consulting. Ron's delighted you joined us and excited to discuss and help you navigate your journey towards becoming an effective leader. During this podcast, ron will share his core belief that effective leadership is one of the key drivers towards change. So together let's grow as leaders. Here's Ron Harvey.
Speaker 2:Good morning. This is Ron Harvey. I'm the Vice President and Chief Operating Officer of Global Core Strategies and I'm welcoming you back once again for Unpacked. With Ron Harvey, we run a leadership firm which is called Global Core and we spend all of our time helping organizations develop and really help their leaders become more prepared for a sustainable future within the organization. How do they stay connected to the people that they're responsible for and responsible to? We do that all the time. We love it, helping leaders be better connected to the workforce, but we do.
Speaker 2:The podcast really is to let you behind the curtain, and it's called Unpacked because our guests always come on. They don't have any questions in advance. We do promise that for all of our listeners, viewers, that we're going to talk about leadership, but we're going to really do it in real time, so it's almost like a live set that you get to see us talk about what's happening, what's taking place, what are we doing, what are we noticing? So hang in with us. I have another phenomenal guest who has a phenomenal resume that I'm super excited has done some great things across the board, and that's what I love about the podcast is we bring people on that's doing great things across our entire society. So I'm happy to have Lior with us and I'm going to hand him the microphone and let him introduce himself. Before we dive into the unpacking piece, lior, let me hand it over to you.
Speaker 3:Well, thank you very much. Thank you for the kind words and thank you for having me on the show. Yeah, I spent the last three decades basically helping organizations transform themselves. The transformation can run anywhere from new strategies to a FDA recall and anything in between. So I got a chance to work with a wide variety of industries B2B, b2c for Mercedes-Benz all the way to Nova Nordisk and Delta Airlines, royal Caribbean, cruise Lines, walmart, a variety of organizations. All, basically, are facing the need to evolve and evolve faster than what they can do, and the methodology that we developed basically helped them do exactly that and achieve some phenomenal results.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So, lior, you spoke about a lot of places that I spend money at, so you know you've done some great work to help them evolve faster, because they do have to evolve, and that's for every single person that's listening to us that change is happening. It's happening faster than ever. It'll happen faster tomorrow, so I'm happy that you're in that space and you said yes to Unpacked with Ron Harvey. One of the things that we always promise is the ability to talk leadership, and you've had a nice blend of clients and people that you get to partner with. When you think about the work that you're doing, where do you see us going forward? The importance of leadership and, regardless of what industry, regardless of what level, how important has leadership become with change happening so fast?
Speaker 3:So I think the definition of leadership is changing dramatically. When we started our careers, the definition of leadership was an invincible leader who knows. You don't know what the right thing to do is. Let me repeat that it's doing the right thing when you do not know what the right thing to do is.
Speaker 3:So stop mirroring your manager from 30 years ago and start facing the reality that you are leading people through uncertainty, ambiguity, complexity and you don't have all the answers. Ambiguity, complexity and you don't have all the answers. And in fact, it is your humanity and your willingness to take action when you don't know what the right action is that will gravitate other people there. So if you understand that we are shifting from invincible leader to a vulnerable leader, then you need to ask yourself what is my toolkit? What is my toolbox? How do I engage people when I don't have all the answers? You know, and that's when the concept of authoring your life story in the new book Dare to Author is extremely critical. So you can actually convert. My definition of authoring your life story is converting past experiences into future resilience and tools to face the future.
Speaker 2:Wow, you gave us a lot to unpack. I mean, we could spend the whole podcast on just that thing of the definition has shifted and what leaders are expected to do, but you're asking leaders to be vulnerable. There are leaders that are listening to this call, that are running organizations, and often when people are vulnerable, you get minimized, marginalized or don't be seen as a subject matter expert anymore. How do you close that gap where I can be vulnerable but be safe?
Speaker 3:Fair question. And I start with a very, very funny example in my situation. So I started my consulting business from zero to about 150 consultants offices in Australia, canada, london, new York and doing these big projects that I mentioned before over 400 transformations worldwide. And the first thing I tell CEOs is I said look, as a CEO myself, I don't know if I'm funny because I don't know if they're laughing because I'm the CEO, or if they're laughing because my jokes are funny and you know what? I probably will never know and I need to learn to live with that. So vulnerability number one you're not sure if you're funny or you're not funny. Let's start with that. But here's what I'm talking about. It in the book. I'll give you a great example.
Speaker 3:I was at the Aria Hotel in Las Vegas about to go on stage major conference, thousands of people there and the CEO of the company stops me there and he says you know, leo, I want to sign up with you to coach me how to speak. I'm a banker, I don't feel comfortable and you connect with the audience much better than me and I want to learn. And I said you know what you really want to learn? He said absolutely. I said here. We're going to do this right now. I want you to tell me why you love this company. When did you fall in love with this company? Why do you love working here? And he's telling me the story, and it's actually a pretty good story. So I said to him you know what? Leave your slides aside. I want you to go right now on stage You're next and I want you to tell them this story and then tell them what you want from them, whatever new strategy you have for the year and stuff like that. And he said to me why would they care? I said just trust me. You want me to coach you. I'm coaching you on the spot. Go out there, don't use a single slide. And I want you to tell them the story of why you love this company and when did you fall in love with it. And he did, and you could hear a pin drop and he came back almost in tears. You know, his background is in finance. He's not your storyteller, he's not your marketeer, something like that.
Speaker 3:And what I try to teach him there is, first of all, when we talk about vulnerability, we're not talking about stripping down everything. This is not ultimate vulnerability. This is not vulnerability for the purpose of vulnerability. This is vulnerability for the purpose of engaging and activating other people to join you on a journey. It's a different thing and in the book, when I talk about leadership, I said be mindful of what you're trying to activate people and share the story that can bring them on board.
Speaker 3:Don't share every story. I don't need to hear about your relationship with your dog and the fact that they had cancer and you had to put them down Not interesting to me right now because I don't know what to do with it. That's just vulnerability for the sake of vulnerability. Use your stories as a way to say I don't know all the answers and I need you to join me, because here's what I want leaders to understand. When you project the invincible leader, you're projecting. I don't need anything from any of you, I just need you to follow blindly and that's not going to resonate well definitely not with Gen Z. They want to make an impact, they want to bring their superpower, they want to bring their talent, they want to be part of a journey. When you project the invincible leader, you're basically blocking them from any of that and they're saying okay, if you know all the answers, forget it, I don't need to be here.
Speaker 2:You're so spot on. So now what we're telling all the people that are listening is the vulnerability and be intentional about what it is and know where you're trying to get them to join you on this journey. Every story doesn't need to be shared, but what's the story that helps to make a connection that wishes they'll wish to follow you. But you said something in there too, Lior is trust. It's at an all-time low. People are having a really tough time just even understanding what it is and what they're asking for. I'll say, Lior, I want you to trust me. If you say, well, what do you want? What does that mean to me? Even leaders are struggling defining what it means and they're struggling at even doing it. So when you say, hey, I want you to trust me, because leaders have to earn trust in my mind. But what is it and how do you build it?
Speaker 3:So I'm going to come back to trust in a second. Okay, just stay with me for a second. Yes, one of the misunderstood topics right now is employee engagement. Okay, yes, everybody wants their employee to engage and we're struggling in a hybrid work environment and so on and so forth. And I'm coming out right here and telling you I disagree with a lot of the employee engagement methods out there. This is not about fun. This is not about making it more fun. Employees are not going to stay with you because you gave them another pizza and another happy hour on Thursday or something like that. In our research, there were two main drivers to employee engagement and retention.
Speaker 3:I understand the impact that I make on other people and I have the tools and authority to get the job done. I want leaders to understand when you ask someone to be responsible for something, the essence of the word responsible is response able. That means you need to give them the ability to respond. You need to give them the tools, you need to give them the empowerment. So let's now visit the concept of trust. Here's the problem. The problem is that we are still using old leadership tools. When I do workshops, I say to the audience please help me fill in the blank. If you want to do it right, and they all say do it yourself. We trust, trust and verify. And I said this is what your manager from 30 years ago told you on your first day. Well, we don't use Windows 95 anymore. So why are we using Management 95 in the workplace today?
Speaker 3:Trust is ultimately the act of giving them the vision and the tools to get the job done. It's not about trusting me blindly. It's about having them join on a journey, and that's what leaders don't understand In the invincible leader model. It's about trust me blindly. And the answer is why? What have you done to be trusted? You know, in the vulnerable leadership model you're saying I don't know as much as you don't know. We're going to discover together and you know what my talent is important and your talent is important because we are going on a journey together. That's a different type of trust. That's a joining hands. This is not following.
Speaker 2:Spot on. I love that. Responsible responds able Like give me permission to respond and make me able to respond, which is provide resources. So I love that. So, as you go down this journey and you think about where we are as a society, it's fair to say we're not using Windows 95. So why are we using Management 95? Would you say unpacking for a minute? I want to unpack response able, but before we go there, command and control leadership is done.
Speaker 3:I want to impact, response able, but before we go there, command and control leadership is done, absolutely. I'll tell you more than that. When I'm being approached to come and help an organization with transformation, they share with me what the strategy is or what decision they made. I turned to the CEO and I said I'm going to deliver to you probably the most painful piece of news right now. I understand what you want to achieve. Now I'm going to go and focus on Susie from accounting and he's like who's Susie from accounting? I said, oh, susie from accounting. She's responsible for the strategy execution. And he's like I don't even know who she is. No, she's not. I said, yes, she is. That's the problem. You see, execution is done at the bottom. If Susie will decide that she's executing, it's going to happen. And if the thousands of employees of yours will decide that they are executing, it's going to happen. And if not, they're going to kill it a hundred small deaths and your strategy is not going to happen.
Speaker 3:Let me share with you a piece of data. In 2017, we have done a benchmark study with Harvard Business Review. We benchmarked 422 companies. We asked them how successful are you with your change programs? 9% 9% out of 100%, stated that they are successful. Then we said okay, so what are the root causes for the lack of success? And is it IT, is it governance? Is it budget? Number one issue is the human factor. This is Susie from accounting. So you want to tell me that command and control is the way to go because you were dreaming about it for the last 90, 30 years, until you become a CEO. Good luck, ain't going to happen. They're not listening to you and we need to understand what the real culture of the organization is and what is the capability of the organization to move faster, because your core competence shifted from product to the speed and scope in which you can move faster. So it's a totally different world and you need to understand that. Command and control is for the old days where your processes were leading the way and your people were just widgets in know, widgets in your system. And today we're in a totally different place and I'll give you another example.
Speaker 3:Let's do a quick exercise. Try to think about your flight to New York last week or back. Yes, on the way, when you boarded the plane, a flight attendant smiled at you. And when you left the plane, a flight attendant was smiling at you. Which smile was more authentic and sincere? When you boarded or when you left the plane? A flight attendant was smiling at you. Which smile was more authentic and sincere? When you boarded or when you left? When I boarded, are you sure, because most people it's. When you left, they were like get out of my face, I don't want to see you anymore. And I use this because the first one was required.
Speaker 1:The second one was from the heart.
Speaker 3:And here's my argument to leaders Every employee shows up to work with an average commitment because they need to survive and get paid. Yes, anything above that creativity, leadership, thinking outside of the box, taking ownership all of these things these are personal choices. This gap between the average, let me hide behind the box. Taking ownership all of these things, these are personal choices. This gap between the average, let me hide behind the process and I'm taking ownership. That's a personal choice of your employees. You cannot mandate it, because you cannot mandate a fake smile. You know they'll have to decide that they want to smile. They have to decide they want to care. If it's fake, it's not helpful. So all of this gap between average performance and exceptional performance is personal choices of your employees and what's going to activate it is your ability to create the environment that invites them to do that. Your leadership is not to command and control, because you're not running processes that I can digitize. I don't need people for that. Your leadership comes in for exactly that gap between average and exceptional performance.
Speaker 2:Hopefully everybody's taking notes. I mean, you're really sharing and unpacking a lot of great information. You're sharing practical things. So if I'm the leader and I want to close the gap between average and exceptional performance to really deliver what we need delivered, what do I bring to the table as a leader, since most of the stuff, as you said, the processes are becoming streamlined and automated? What do I need to bring as the human portion of that to help close that gap as a leader?
Speaker 3:I think that first, as a leader, you need to decide is your organization a sum total of processes that happens to be operated by people, or your organization is a sum total of people that happen to use processes? This is not just a statement. It's a fundamental difference in what type of organization you want to create. If you choose the first one, then you will always be average and you'll never be exceptional, because processes are designed for common denominator. The other option, where your people business that happens to use processes, that's when your people can rise up and start personalized and start creating value and start creating differentiation and start creating exceptional performance that will create loyalty towards your business. So that's the first decision you need to get in your head. The processes is not the purpose. The processes are just a tool. Okay, now, if you're in the people business and we are living in a world of VUCA, of vulnerability, uncertainty, complexity and ambiguity, and you don't have all the answers, then you're charting a path in which you help them understand the vision, but you don't know all the details and all the answers. You're going to evolve as you're going to go along. I'll give you a simple example of one of the most successful companies we know today Salesforce, salesforce today are not just selling Salesforce. Their name shows that even they did not have a big enough of a vision to where they can go, and today they're in the cloud business and other businesses that are not CRM and Salesforce, you know.
Speaker 3:So in Dare to Author, I talk about have a deliberate vision, but not a detailed vision, not a detailed vision and then work with your team to inspire them with examples and stories that can activate their choice to go and deliver above and beyond. And that comes from stories People. Let me put it this way for you and I know some leaders are going to hate it we do not follow facts, we do not follow data, we follow stories. You don't believe me? Just look at January 1st. On January 1st, hundreds of millions of Americans are going to go on the scale. They're going to get the data and then they're not going to do anything about it. They're going to hate the data on the scale that tells them that they probably should be losing some weight, but they're not going to do anything about it.
Speaker 3:Data doesn't drive people. Stories do, and I'll tell you what the beauty of the vulnerable environment we are in. In the previous environment, employees did not really have a place to express themselves and make a big impact because the processes were really leading the way, but today, and especially with AI that will take over some labor-intensive work, we're actually opening an amazing opportunity for employees to come and be partners in creating a new future, as opposed to just repeating the past. So I think that what's nervous for some people is really an exciting new path, under the one condition that we author our own story and we will not let circumstances author that story. We will not give agency to our fears, prejudice and otherwise to author our story. We need to dare to author our own story.
Speaker 2:So data tells story. Sel is what I'm hearing from you. Data you have it, but stories have to be there. What advice do you give to a new leader or a young leader, someone that's figuring out? I can tell you, I'm a veteran, 21 years of Army service and my first leadership. Well, I had no clue. I had to figure it out. The airplane was in the air. I just tried everything I could to make sure I didn't crash the airplane, and that was my first leadership experience. What? I just tried everything I could to make sure I didn't crash the airplane, and that was my first leadership experience. What do you offer to leaders so they don't always have to be nervous about how to get to this destination of a better leader? What advice do you give to leaders that are listening, that are new in this seat of leadership?
Speaker 3:So I'm going to do a quick exercise with you that I do in workshops, and I want everybody to go through the same thought. Okay, so I have a new startup that I want to share with you, and it's called Entitled Achievements. Okay, my startup, my startup is focusing on people who have big dreams but lack discipline in executing them. For example, you want to run a marathon. You just don't want to practice. Okay, so let's take the New York marathon. Okay, you will sign's take the New York Marathon. Okay, you will sign up for the New York Marathon, get your own bib and everything else. You'll run the first 500 meters and then, right there on the side, I'll be waiting for you with a special car. We'll be driving you to the finish line. 500 meters before the finish line. You'll run that. You'll cross the finish line. You'll get the picture line. You'll run that. You'll cross the finish line. You'll get the picture. You'll get the medal. You'll put it on instagram. Would you take this service or not?
Speaker 2:no, why not? Because lack of integrity, it's not real, it's not being truthful. What else that would probably be? The main reason, honestly, is that I didn't do what I said I was going to do run the marathon.
Speaker 3:So, in a sense, this medal is not meaningful to you because you don't put the effort and it doesn't reflect your values right. Yes, I would submit to your consideration. There's an even deeper layer. The notion that you may never finish made finishing it even sweeter. The possibility of failure made this medal more meaningful, and my first message to leaders is the fear should be your driver. Don't deny it, don't say it doesn't exist, but understand. Just like with the example of the medal, it is the notion that we may fail that actually can help us enjoy what we achieve later. So that's the first thing. Second thing in the book, as I mentioned, you know my assertion in the book is if you do not author your life story, it will be authored for you, and one of the examples of what's authoring our life story where we give agency is what I coined in the book is the gratitude denial syndrome.
Speaker 3:The gratitude denial syndrome is our response to any type of positive feedback we receive. We downplay it, we belittle it, we dismiss it, and I'm arguing that this is not only the wrong thing to do. It's pretty dangerous, because when you receive positive feedback, you actually receive clues about your superpower, clues about how you impact other people. If you want to be ready for the unknown situation tomorrow, you need to take this feedback and have this as an energy to face the future. When you belittle it, when you dismiss it, you are robbing yourself from ref. Dismiss it, you are robbing yourself from refueling. You're robbing yourself from the energy that's supposed to take you there. So, as a new leader, please listen to those things, without the dismissal, without the belittling, without the downplay.
Speaker 3:Say thank you, reflect and start to understand what your superpower is. Some of us, our superpower, will be very result-driven. Others is in compassion. Others will be able to describe a journey. Others will be able to inspire with big visions. We all have different. Others will use humor. Same situation, different engagements. Learn your superpower through not downplaying the gratitude, but receiving it. Not to become arrogant, but to become confident and to know more what your superpower is.
Speaker 2:Phenomenal, I love. I mean, you took them down two paths of how to really pay attention to showing up as a leader, and there are tons of books out there, but the practical thing of unpack you know that we talk about is real stuff that you can use. So, as we begin to come to a close, a couple of minutes left in the podcast for us. When you think about the challenges that organizational leaders are facing today, what are the top three and how do they overcome them?
Speaker 3:In my recent articles. I'm talking about AI, not in the context of the workforce, but in the context of customers. I would submit to you that the number one challenge of organizations today is to understand that AI is probably the tipping point in changing the relationship between customers and brands, pin point in changing the relationship between customers and brands. And customers today are so empowered to the point that they are becoming the brand and we need to redefine our roles. So that's item number one. Item number two for organizations on the workforce side is where would the next leaders come? Because if you're going to be hybrid, what is going to be missed is, you know, through Zoom you can get a lot of people to follow a lot of tasks, but you don't get them to learn the business by osmosis. You don't get a lot of the interactions that are going to have the next leaders rise up. So I think organizations need to be much more conscientious and much more purposeful about how they're going to grow the next leaders. Otherwise, in 10 years from now, we're going to be facing some serious crisis of a lot of people that likes to work in hybrid but do not understand that. And the third thing around the product and the solution. So we are shifting.
Speaker 3:In my writing I talk about the new era of customer engagement, which I call it the one and only. Our customers are no longer a segment. Our customers are no longer anything like that. They're the only one. They want the full attention. As far as I'm concerned, you exist only for their purpose. So how do you adapt your value proposition to serve the one and only customer is going to be another critical challenge.
Speaker 2:It is so true. I mean because we all have this hyper focus on I want to be seen and heard at the moment that I'm in front of you. So I love that you're saying that and you got to do a phenomenal job of. There used to be a song back in the day love the one you with, like whoever's there, love them at that moment and you continue to expand that I want to be. Even if I'm a room full of people, when you're talking to me, I want to feel like I'm the only person that you see, and that's important. I mean, I say that as a leader, I want to know that you see me at that moment. Now, what you do 10 minutes after I'm gone, I'm not paying attention, I'm not concerned, but those 10 minutes you're in front of me, I want your attention.
Speaker 2:So, leo, you've dropped a lot of great data, a lot of points. First of all, if someone wants to leverage your services, what are the top three things that will be happening in my company? That says time to pick up the phone and reach out to you. What's taking place? That says I need your help.
Speaker 3:Okay. So, first and foremost, if you see a cost of acquisition of customers going up and your profitability going down, call us, Because that's one area that customers are engaging with us. It's not just about customer satisfaction. We go straight for profitability and retention. We need to reengage the customer experience because obviously you're not delivering the right value for them for the money that you're asking.
Speaker 3:Second thing is, if you go through any type of change or crisis it can be new technology, digital digitization or anything else and you need to activate your team, then that's where our specialty comes in. We know how to activate thousands and thousands of people in remote locations and gather them around writing the next chapter of the organization and be part of the journey. So that will be another example and the last one. You've got the ideas. You want to make it happen. It's been dragging in the organization. We can accelerate it with workshops that can get you on a 90-day cycles of starting to get some results done. So, from value proposition and retention through activation of change and, if you need it, in a very focused way, the workshops are the way to accelerate performance and change.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love it. I love it Three ways, or three reasons why and I'd say everyone that's listening you ought to know three reasons why people should call you as well. What's happening that they can see. That says pick up the phone. So, lior, how do we reach you? I know you're on LinkedIn, I have your information, but for our listeners and our viewers, what's the most effective way to reach out to you and your organization? One, if I need your services. Two, if someone else is interested in bringing you on a podcast Sure, absolutely.
Speaker 3:Sure, absolutely. So. Leorarusicom is the best way to reach me. I put all my articles and everything there, so leorarusicom will be the first destination. Linkedin is another area where I'm very, very active. So if you want to see the latest thinking, it's all posted there, some interesting discussions and so on. So I would say those are the two first entry point. I'm also a chairman of a company called ImprintCX, which provides those services as well, so Imprint CX will be the other destination where you can. If you want to look at it more from a services standpoint and so on and so forth, imprint CX will be a good starting point as well.
Speaker 2:Awesome, Two questions what's the biggest challenge you had to overcome being an entrepreneur yourself?
Speaker 3:When I started the business, I knew what I wanted to do, but there were so many other consulting businesses that I'm like the world doesn't need another Arusi and Associates, you know? So how do you differentiate yourself? And, by the way, my first round I fell flat. The first year fell flat on all my ideas and I had to come back. And I want everybody to know you know, don't just read the good stories. I mean, we all went through scars. We all went through those pains and stuff like that. So I built a model and I built methodology that ultimately solved a bigger problem than what my competition was doing. I introduced a new pricing model that was flat fee, based on deliverables and not based on hourly rate or anything else. So I've absorbed that.
Speaker 3:And the last thing and I think everyone that's in business should know is choose your customers carefully. Not everyone that has a budget and knows to spell your name is a customer or a potential customer, because the moment you engage with the wrong customers, you're screwing yourself twice. You're taking profits from the profitable customers and you're screwing yourself twice. You're taking profits from the profitable customers and you're wasting them on people who do not appreciate your value and you are not available to deliver, exceptional to the profitable customers. Yes, so the hardest discipline, especially when you care about cashflow, and so, help me, god, I've had that as well and so on and so forth.
Speaker 3:Be careful of the wrong customers. Train your people to sniff the wrong customers. Teach them what are the characteristics of who's the right customer and who's the wrong customer. And the other ones, be generous, send them to the competition. I believe in win-win. Win-win is when you take your worst customers and you send them to the competition. Then you win twice. Your competition is stuck with the wrong customers and you can delight your real customers. That's a great win-win.
Speaker 2:Sounds like a setup. Leo, I appreciate it. I mean great, great. Thank you for coming on the podcast. Is there anything that you'd like to close out with for people that are listening? Any books you're releasing, anything you want to share as a closeout?
Speaker 3:So Dare to Author just came out late October. Based on the stats, we are about to finish the first sprint, which is wonderful. We are in less than a month from now and I will tell you. The responses are phenomenal. People feel that it's changing their lives. So my message to everyone is if you love someone, get them the book, and if you love yourself, get yourself the book yes, book.
Speaker 2:And if you love yourself, get yourself the book. Yes yes, and it's the holiday season. What?
Speaker 3:a perfect time to get a great gift.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, is it on Amazon. Where did they find it?
Speaker 3:It is on Amazon, it is on Barnes, noble and other places. Dare to author. Love someone. Give them the book. Believe me, they'll be thankful.
Speaker 2:Yes yes, yes, yes. Thank you so much. You've been a phenomenal guest. Love to have you back. I mean I can have this conversation probably a whole lot longer than we want to run the podcast, but love to have you back and if there's anything that we can do to make sure that you're successful in your business, love to and for everyone that's listening, join us.
Speaker 2:Every single Monday we release a different version, a different guest that comes on and share real insight, and we have fun with it. So thank you for joining us on Unpacked with Ron Harvey. You can always find us on our website, global for Strategies, and you can also find me on LinkedIn. Those are probably the two best places that you'll find anything that I'm doing or where you can connect with me. Love to hear from you, love to have you as a guest, love to see if it's an opportunity for us to support what you're trying to get done, leo or I we're both here and what I tell you.
Speaker 2:I actually promote other businesses that do exactly or something similar to what I do. There's enough for everybody. Business owners, just be good at what you do. There's enough for all of us. So until next time, leo and I will sign off. It's been great. Thank you all for joining us. Have a happy holiday season, and I will get this podcast up a lot sooner because I love what you're sharing. So thank you all for joining us and until next time, leo and I will sign off.
Speaker 1:We hope you enjoyed this edition of Turning Point Leadership with your host, Ron Harvey. We're so glad you joined us. Remember to join us every first and third Mondays and expect to receive real answers for real leadership challenges. Until next time, make a difference where you are and with what you have. There are those who are counting on you for effective leadership.
